<html><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div>governance:</div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div>I think we need to get the CLAs signed as Brett has suggested. Any <b>guidelines</b> on project naming should be decided by this smaller governance group. My suggestion is that we do this first, and then go about naming our own projects. This smaller group should decide on things like whether or not we want to have a convention that ties the projects together e.g. "All projects begin with BeerAndWings, sub projects are denoted with a suffix indicating their language, /J /C" </div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div>as for project naming in general:</div><div><br></div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div><div>On Naming an open source project:</div><div><a href="http://www.advogato.org/article/67.html">http://www.advogato.org/article/67.html</a></div><div><br></div></div><div>Here is a list of apache top level projects, many are headers for lots of other projects (down below the list I make my point):</div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 14px; white-space: nowrap; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 4px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 4px; "><li><a href="http://httpd.apache.org/" title="Apache Web Server (httpd)">HTTP Server</a></li><li><a href="http://activemq.apache.org/" title="Distributed Messaging System">ActiveMQ</a></li><li><a href="http://ant.apache.org/" title="Java-based build tool">Ant</a></li><li><a href="http://apr.apache.org/" title="Apache Portable Runtime libraries">APR</a></li><li><a href="http://beehive.apache.org/" title="Metadata frameworks for enterprise applications">Beehive</a></li><li><a href="http://cayenne.apache.org/" title="User-friendly Java ORM with Tools">Cayenne</a></li><li><a href="http://cocoon.apache.org/" title="Web development framework: separation of concerns, component-based">Cocoon</a></li><li><a href="http://commons.apache.org/" title="Reusable Java components">Commons</a></li><li><a href="http://continuum.apache.org/" title="Continuous Integration and Build Server">Continuum</a></li><li><a href="http://db.apache.org/" title="Database access">DB</a></li><li><a href="http://directory.apache.org/" title="Apache Directory Server">Directory</a></li><li><a href="http://excalibur.apache.org/" title="Embeddable software libraries related to component and service management access">Excalibur</a></li><li><a href="http://felix.apache.org/" title="OSGi Framework and components.">Felix</a></li><li><a href="http://forrest.apache.org/" title="Aggregated multi-channel documentation, separation of concerns">Forrest</a></li><li><a href="http://geronimo.apache.org/" title="Java2, Enterprise Edition (J2EE) container">Geronimo</a></li><li><a href="http://gump.apache.org/" title="Continuous integration of open source projects">Gump</a></li><li><a href="http://hadoop.apache.org/" title="Distributed computing platform">Hadoop</a></li><li><a href="http://harmony.apache.org/" title="Open source implementation of Java SE">Harmony</a></li><li><a href="http://hivemind.apache.org/" title="A services and configuration microkernel">HiveMind</a></li><li><a href="http://hc.apache.org/" title="Java toolset of low level HTTP components">HttpComponents</a></li><li><a href="http://ibatis.apache.org/" title="SQL Data Mapper for Java and .NET">iBATIS</a></li><li><a href="http://incubator.apache.org/" title="Shepherd for new projects">Incubator</a></li><li><a href="http://jackrabbit.apache.org/" title="Content Repository for Java">Jackrabbit</a></li><li><a href="http://jakarta.apache.org/" title="Server-side Java">Jakarta</a></li><li><a href="http://james.apache.org/" title="Java Apache Mail Enterprise Server">James</a></li><li><a href="http://labs.apache.org/" title="The Innovation Laboratories of the Apache Software Foundation">Labs</a></li><li><a href="http://lenya.apache.org/" title="Content Management System">Lenya</a></li><li><a href="http://logging.apache.org/" title="Cross-language logging services">Logging</a></li><li><a href="http://lucene.apache.org/" title="Search engine library">Lucene</a></li><li><a href="http://maven.apache.org/" title="Java project management and comprehension tools">Maven</a></li><li><a href="http://mina.apache.org/" title="Multipurpose Infrastructure for Network Application">Mina</a></li><li><a href="http://myfaces.apache.org/" title="JavaServer(tm) Faces implementation and components">MyFaces</a></li><li><a href="http://ode.apache.org/" title="Orchestration Director Engine: Business Process Management (BPM), Process Orchestration and Workflow through service compositioni.">ODE</a></li><li><a href="http://ofbiz.apache.org/" title="Open for Business: enterprise automation software">OFBiz</a></li><li><a href="http://openejb.apache.org/" title="OpenEJB: a modular, configurable, and extendable EJB Container System and Server">OpenEJB</a></li><li><a href="http://openjpa.apache.org/" title="OpenJPA: Object Relational Mapping for Java">OpenJPA</a></li><li><a href="http://perl.apache.org/" title="Dynamic websites using Perl">Perl</a></li><li><a href="http://poi.apache.org/" title="Java API for OLE 2 Compound Documents">POI</a></li><li><a href="http://portals.apache.org/" title="Portal technology">Portals</a></li><li><a href="http://roller.apache.org/" title="Java blog server">Roller</a></li><li><a href="http://santuario.apache.org/" title="XML Security in Java and C++">Santuario</a></li><li><a href="http://servicemix.apache.org/" title="Enterprise Service Bus">ServiceMix</a></li><li><a href="http://shale.apache.org/" title="Web application framework based on JavaServer(tm) Faces">Shale</a></li><li><a href="http://spamassassin.apache.org/" title="Mail filter to identify spam">SpamAssassin</a></li><li><a href="http://stdcxx.apache.org/" title="Apache C++ Standard Library">STDCXX</a></li><li><a href="http://struts.apache.org/" title="Model 2 framework for building Java web applications">Struts</a></li><li><a href="http://synapse.apache.org/" title="Enterprise Service Bus and Mediation Framework">Synapse</a></li><li><a href="http://tapestry.apache.org/" title="Component-based Java Web Application Framework">Tapestry</a></li><li><a href="http://tcl.apache.org/" title="Dynamic websites using TCL">TCL</a></li><li><a href="http://tiles.apache.org/" title="A templating framework for web application user interfaces">Tiles</a></li><li><a href="http://tomcat.apache.org/" title="A Java Servlet and JSP Container">Tomcat</a></li><li><a href="http://turbine.apache.org/" title="A Java Servlet Web Application Framework and associated component library"> Turbine</a></li><li><a href="http://velocity.apache.org/" title="A Java Templating Engine">Velocity</a></li><li><a href="http://wicket.apache.org/" title="Component-based Java Web Application Framework.">Wicket</a></li><li><a href="http://ws.apache.org/">Web Services</a></li><li><a href="http://xalan.apache.org/" title="XSLT processors in Java and C++">Xalan</a></li><li><a href="http://xerces.apache.org/" title="XML parsers in Java, C++ and Perl">Xerces</a></li><li><a href="http://xml.apache.org/" title="XML solutions focused on the web">XML</a></li><li><a href="http://xmlbeans.apache.org/" title="XML-Java binding tool">XMLBeans</a></li><li><a href="http://xmlgraphics.apache.org/" title="Conversion from XML to graphical output">XML Graphics</a></li></span></div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div>Hmm.... seems all over the road in terms of naming conventions, yet, I know of, use, and refer to many of these projects all the time. I'd like to note also that "HTTP Server" is actually the apache web server, as I am sure you all know. So this supports Phil's point about not calling the ID-WSF 2 libraries "OpenLiberty." Obviously at the highest level (Apache foundation's list of projects) they decided it should not be referred to as apache, even though it is apache everywhere else in the world... there's a lot in a name. </div><div><br></div><div>more later when I have had some time to think,</div><div><br></div><div>asa</div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><br><div> <span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Verdana; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div><div>--</div><div>Asa Hardcastle, Technical Lead, openLiberty ID-WSF ClientLib</div><div>Tel: +1.413.429.1044 Skype: subsystem7</div></div></div></span> </div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><br><div><div>On Mar 22, 2008, at 7:27 PM, Brett McDowell wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite">If Phil has the premise correct -- i.e. if all the WSF projects do actually breakdown neatly into Toolkit, AppKit, and ProviderKit -- then how about..<br><br>option A:<br>OpenLiberty TrustFed ToolKit<br>OpenLiberty TrustFed AppKit<br> OpenLiberty TrustFed ProviderKit<br><br>option B: (I'm just throwing something out there... it seems the heart of WSF is the concept of "my services")<br>OpenLiberty MyServices ToolKit<br>OpenLiberty MyServices AppKit<br> OpenLiberty MyServices ProviderKit<br><br>option C (already one vote against this from Phil, but let's just keep the options on the table until we get a decision):<br>OpenLiberty OpenWSF ToolKit<br>OpenLiberty OpenWSF AppKit<br> OpenLiberty OpenWSF ProviderKit<br><br>option D: (noting one vote for this from Phil... maybe)<br>OpenLiberty Panda ToolKit<br>OpenLiberty Panda AppKit<br>OpenLiberty Panda ProviderKit<br><br>option E ??<br><br>But I have a meta-question... who should be making this decision anyway? I think with Sampo, Conor and AOL (presumably George Fletcher) signing CLA's (any day now?) we finally have an official independent group of contributors to take over "governance" of this project. And since this naming does impact the other IGF project we need to add Phil and Prateek to that list. So maybe only Phil, Prateek, Asa, Sampo, Conor, and George need to make this decision? Gentlemen, are we at that point yet?<br> <br><div> Brett McDowell | <a href="http://www.projectliberty.org">Liberty Alliance</a> | <a href="http://www.ictprojects.com/Brett_McDowell_LAP.vcf">vCard</a> | <a href="http://www.google.com/calendar/hosted/ictprojects.com/embed?src=brett%40ictprojects.com&ctz=America/New_York">Calendar</a> </div><br><br></blockquote></div><br></body></html>